>>> JACK SMITH’S EFFORT TO KEEP
HIS COUP TRIAL ON TRACK, IT IS
SCHEDULED FOR MARCH.
SMITH IS NOW DEFENDING HIS WIN
OVER TRUMP ON THAT IMMUNITY
ISSUE.
THEY WILL REVIEW THE DISTRICT
JUDGE REJECTING TRUMP’S CLAIM
THAT A FORMER PRESIDENT SHOULD
BE IMMUNE FROM EVERYTHING.
YOU CAN ALMOST HERE THE
EYE-ROLLING IN THAT REPORT.
IT’S BECAUSE FEW PEOPLE, EXPERTS
IN LAW OR POLITICS HAVE EVER
AGREED WITH TRUMP’S EXTREME
CLAIM.
INDEED, IF YOU’RE NOT INTO LAW
BUT YOU HAVE A BASIC MEMORY OF
AMERICAN HISTORY, SOMETHING WE
TALKED ABOUT AT THE TOP OF THE
PROGRAM, YOU MAY KNOW FORMER
PRESIDENTS ARE NOT AUTOMATICALLY
IMMUNE FROM POTENTIAL
PROSECUTION.
THAT’S NEVER BEEN ANY KIND OF
RULE AND THAT’S WHY AS MANY KNOW
PRESIDENT FORD PARDONED FORMER
PRESIDENT NIXON PRECISELY
BECAUSE OTHERWISE, THE FORMER
PRESIDENT, AT THAT TIME NIXON,
COULD HAVE BEEN CHARGED.
>> I GERALD R. FORD, PRESIDENT
OF THE UNITED STATES, HAVE
GRANTED AND BY THESE PRESENTS DO
GRANT A FULL, FREE, AND ABSOLUTE
PARDON UNTO RICHARD NIXON FOR
ALL OFFENSES AGAINST THE UNITED
STATES WHICH HE, RICHARD NIXON,
HAS COMMITTED OR MAY HAVE
COMMITTED OR TAKEN PART IN
DURING THE PERIOD FROM JULY 20,
1969, THROUGH AUGUST 9, 1974.
>> THERE IT WAS.
A PARDON FOR SOMEONE WHO WASN’T
IMMUNE SO HE WOULD NEED A
PARDON.
MORE RECENTLY, TOP REPUBLICANS
HAVE OPERATED ON THE OBVIOUS
PREMISE THAT THE CRIMINAL
JUSTICE SYSTEM COULD POTENTIALLY
PUT TRUMP ON TRIAL AFTER HE LEFT
THE WHITE HOUSE.
TAKE THE MOST POWERFUL
REPUBLICAN IN THE SENATE, MITCH
McCONNELL, EMPHASIZING THAT
EXACT POINT DURING TRUMP’S
SENATE TRIAL AFTER IMPEACHMENT.
>> TRUMP IS STILL LIABLE FOR
EVERYTHING HE DID WHILE HE WAS
IN OFFICE.
AS AN ORDINARY CITIZEN.
WE HAVE A CRIMINAL JUSTICE
SYSTEM IN THIS COUNTRY.
WE HAVE CIVIL LITIGATION.
AND FORMER PRESIDENTS ARE NOT
IMMUNE FROM BEING ACCOUNTABLE BY
EITHER ONE.
>> AND TO BE CLEAR, I’M SHOWING
YOU THAT NOT JUST TO SAY OH,
LOOK, THAT’S WHAT THEY SAID.
BUT THAT WAS SO RUDIMENTARY, SO
OBVIOUS, SO PLAIN THAT McCONNELL
WASN’T MAKING WAVES BY SAYING
IT.
IT WAS JUST THE STATE OF PLAY.
IF YOU WANT TO CHECK THE JUSTICE
DEPARTMENT, LONG BEFORE JACK
SUBMITTED OR ANYONE ELSE CAME
ALONG, IT HAS HELD THE VIEW IN
WRITING THAT FORMER PRESIDENTS
CAN BE PROSECUTED AND THAT
SPECIFICALLY THE CONSTITUTION
PERMITS A FORMER PRESIDENT TO BE
CRIMINALLY PROSECUTED FOR THE
SAME OFFENSES FOR WHICH HE WAS
IMPEACHED AND THEN ACQUITTED BY
THE SENATE WHILE IN OFFICE, AS
THIS MEMO EXPLAINS.
TRUMP WAS ACQUITTED FOR THE
NARROW CHARGE OF INCITING
INSURRECTION.
JACK SMITH IS PROSECUTING HIM
FOR OTHER CHARGES RELATED TO
JANUARY 6th PLOTS.
TRUMP’S APPEAL CLAIMS THAT HE
SHOULD STILL HAVE THIS MAGIC
IMMUNITY BECAUSE ANYTHING HE DID
WAS AN OFFICIAL ACT.
AND HE SAYS IF HE IS BASICALLY
TRIED, IF THIS CASE GOES
FORWARD, THERE WOULD BE
POLITICALLY MOTIVATED
PROSECUTIONS WHICH ARE MORE
MENACING AND CRIPPLING TO THE
PRESIDENCY THAN THE THREAT OF
CIVIL SUITS.
THAT SECOND PASSAGE THERE IS,
IT’S JUST LEGALLY DEAD ON
ARRIVAL.
JUDGES, THAT’S WHO HE’S TALKING
TO.
THIS IS NOT PR, NOT TRUTH
SOCIAL.
JUDGES KNOW TRUMP LOST THE
ELECTION.
NO COURT, LET ALONE THE SUPREME
COURT, FOUND THE KIND OF
WIDESPREAD FRAUD THAT COULD
ALTER THE SQUOUT COME IN A
SINGLE STATE, LET ALONE THE
SEVERAL STATES THAT TRUMP LOST
BY.
APART FROM LYING ABOUT THE
ELECTION HE LOST, TRUMP IS
HOPING THAT HIS LAWYERS CAN GET
THE SUPREME COURT TO EMBRACE
EITHER THIS MAGIC NEW IMMUNITY
THEORY OR THAT THIS WHOLE
PROCESS WILL DELAY THE CASE.
AND THE GUY KNOWS HOW TO DELAY.
SMITH IS TRYING TO WARN THIS
COURT AND EVENTUALLY THE SUPREME
COURT WHERE YOU WILL SEE THESE
ARGUMENTS IF THEY TAKE THE CASE,
EVEN IF THEY FOUND THERE WAS A
PARTISAN BASIS, YOU WERE JUST
TRYING TO HELP TRUMP, IF YOU
THINK COURTS OPERATE THAT WAY.
THERE WOULD BE LARGER ALARM
BELLS AND DANGER.
IN PRECEDENT.
TRUMP SAYING TOTAL IMMUNITY TO
PROTECT A PRESIDENT WHO INCITES
HIS SUPPORTERS DURING A STATE OF
UNION ADDRESS TO KILL OPPOSING
LAWMAKERS TO ENSURE THAT HE
REMAINS IN OFFICE UNLAWFULLY.
NOW, TRUMP’S LAWYERS DO NOT HAVE
A VERY GOOD RESPONSE ABOUT
DETERRING THAT.
THEY ARGUE INSTEAD THAT THE
IMPEACHMENT OF A SITTING
PRESIDENT AND THE POTENTIAL
REMOVAL BY THE SENATE WOULD BE
ENOUGH.
THEY SAY, QUOTE, THE SENATE HAS
THE CONSTITUTIONAL AUTHORITY TO
PROSECUTE A PRESIDENT THROUGH
IMPEACHMENT.
THERE IS A LITTLE PROBLEM HERE.
I KNOW IT MIGHT FEEL LIKE WE’RE
GOING TO AN EPISODE OF "24" BUT
I’M LITERALLY REPORTING WHAT
JACK SMITH WHO IS A SERIOUS
STRAIGHT SHOOTER AND THE TRUMP
LAWYERS ARE ARGUING ABOUT.
IN JACK SMITH’S HYPOTHETICAL,
THE SENATE THAT THE TRUMP
LAWYERS CITED, THAT THEY COULD
BE KILLED BY A MURDEROUS
AUTHORITARIAN PRESIDENT TO
PREVENT EVEN THAT THIN SENATE
IMPEACHMENT AND REMOVAL ACCOUNT
ACHBLT
ACT.
SMITH IS WARNING THE JUDGES
ABOUT THIS WHEN TRUMP’S FANS
OPENLY, TRUMP FANS OPENLY TRIED
TO HANG THE SITTING VICE
PRESIDENT AT THE TIME.
TO ASSASSINATE REPUBLICAN MIKE
PENCE.
THEY BUILT A GALLOWS, FOR
GOODNESS SAKES.
AND THEN SENATORS WERE SENT
SPRINTING AWAY TO AVOID HARM OR
DEATH.
A SCENE THAT TRUMP’S LAWYERS
WANT THE COURTS TO FORGET BOTH
IN THIS APPEAL THAT I’M TELLING
YOU ABOUT TONIGHT, AND THE
POTENTIALLY MORE SERIOUS
CRIMINAL TRIAL, IF IT HAPPENS,
PLANNED FOR MARCH.
NOW, THESE SCENES WHICH AGAIN
WOULD BECOME EVIDENCE IN THE
MARCH TRIAL LED TO THE FASTEST
IMPEACHMENT EVER WHERE TRUMP’S
OWN LAWYERS ACTUALLY REITERATED
THIS POINT JUST MENTIONED
TONIGHT MOMENTS AGO.
THAT NIXON TOOK THE PARDON
BECAUSE OTHERWISE, HE COULD HAVE
BEEN ARRESTED, CONVICTED AND
IMPRISONED.
TRUMP’S LAWYERS EVEN DANGLED
THAT AS THE OBVIOUS ALTERNATIVE
TO OUSTING HIM FROM THE WHITE
HOUSE WITH A FEW DAYS LEFT OVER
THE IMPEACHMENT.
ATTORNEY FOR TRUMP.
BRUCE CASTOR TOLD THE SENATORS
HOW TRUMP COULD BE ARRESTED JUST
AFTER HE’S OUT OF OFFICE.
>> AFTER HE’S OUT OF OFFICE, YOU
GO AND ARREST HIM.
SO THERE IS NO OPPORTUNITY WHERE
THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED
STATES CAN RUN RAMPANT IN
JANUARY AT THE END OF HIS TERM
AND GO AWAY SCOTT-FREE.
THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE DOES
KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH SUCH
PEOPLE.
INDEED IT DOES.
THAT’S TRUMP’S OWN LAWYER SAYING
THE THINGS THAT TRUMP’S OWN
LAWYERS SAYING WHAT CANNOT
HAPPEN.
THEY DID ARREST AND BOOK TRUMP
>>> AFTER HE’S OUT OF OFFICE,
YOU GO AND ARREST HIM.
SO THERE IS NO OPPORTUNITY WHERE
THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED
STATES CAN RUN RAMPANT IN
JANUARY AT THE END OF HIS TERM
AND JUST GO AWAY SCOTT-FREE.
THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE DOES
KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH SUCH
PEOPLE.
>> WE’RE BACK WITH ANDREW
WEISSMAN.
WAS DONALD TRUMP’S DEFENSE
LAWYER CORRECT?
>> AS JACK SMITH SAID IN HIS
PAPERS TO THE D.C. CIRCUIT ON
THIS ISSUE, HE POINTED OUT THAT
EXACT QUOTE SAYING THAT DONALD
TRUMP TOLD THE SENATE THAT HE
COULD BE IN FACT PROSECUTED
AFTER HE LEFT OFFICE, AND NOW
THAT HE IS OUT OF OFFICE, HE
SAYS, NO, I CAN’T BE IF I HAVE
BEEN ACQUITTED.
IF I’VE BEEN CHARGED AND
ACQUITTED BY THE SENATE, THEN
THERE’S A GET OUT OF JAIL FREE
CARD THAT HE CANNOT BE
PROSECUTED.
HE POUNLTS OUT THAT
INCONSISTENCY.
AND THIS REALLY RELIES ON WHAT
IS CALL THE IMPEACHMENT JUDGMENT
CLAUSE WHICH SAYS THAT --
>> LET’S GET INTO IT, ANDREW.
>> SO THE CLAUSE SAYS IF YOU
HAVE BEEN IMPEACHED AND YOU HAVE
BEEN CONVICTED, THEN YOU ARE
SUBJECT AFTERWARDS TO BEING
CRIMINALLY PROSECUTED.
MEANING JUST BECAUSE YOU’VE BEEN
CLEARED FROM OFFICE DOESN’T MEAN
THAT YOU CAN’T FACE CRIMINAL
PROSECUTION.
DONALD TRUMP SAYS THAT HAS A
NEGATIVE IMPLICATION.
IF YOU’VE BEEN ACQUITTED BY THE
SENATE, THEN YOU CANNOT BE.
AND THAT IS REALLY GOING TO BE A
BIT OF A BATTLE GROUND IN THE
D.C. CIRCUIT.
I THINK JACK SMITH HAS A MUCH
BETTER ARGUMENT HERE.
THAT IS THE DEBATE ABOUT WHEN
THEY TALK ABOUT WHAT CAN HAPPEN
IF YOU’RE CONVICTED BUT IT
DOESN’T TALK ABOUT WHAT CAN
HAPPEN IF YOU’RE ACQUITTED.
>> IF THE D.C. CIRCUIT UPHOLDS
THE LOWER RULING, WHICH TO
GENERALIZE, IS WHAT USUALLY
HAPPENS, THEN THE CASE IS BACK
ALIVE.
THEY APPEAL TO THE SUPREME
COURT.
THEN WHAT HAPPENS?
>> WELL, THE MAIN ISSUE I SEE IS
THE SUPREME COURT COULD TAKE IT.
THE QUESTION IS THE SPEED WITH
WHICH THEY DO THAT.
THE NORMAL RULES ARE, THE PERSON
WHO LOSES IN THE APPELLATE COURT
ACTUALLY HAS A LOT OF TIME TO
SEEK FURTHER REVIEW AT THE
APPELLATE LEVEL.
EVEN BEFORE YOU GET TO THE
SUPREME COURT, YOU CAN ASK THE
PANEL THAT RULED TO RECONSIDER.
YOU CAN ASK THE WHOLE COURT TO
HERE IT BECAUSE THE PANEL IS
JUST THREE JUDGES.
YOU CAN ASK THE ENTIRE D.C.
CIRCUIT JUDGES TO HERE THE CASE.
WHY AM I RAISING THAT?
ALL OF THAT ENTAILS DELAY.
THEN YOU WOULD SAY, OKAY, I HAVE
90 DAYS TO APPEAL AND TO SEEK
SUPREME COURT REVIEW.
SAY YOU HAVE TO DO THIS VERY,
VERY QUICKLY.
AND I SUSPECT THAT IS WHAT WILL
HAPPEN.
THAT’S JUST WAY TOO LONG A TIME
PERIOD TO KEEP THIS ON HOLD.
THAT WILL DEFINITELY BE DONALD
TRUMP’S PLAY.
>> TO CLARIFY, YOU’RE SEEING THE
D.C. CIRCUIT?
OR WHO WOULD CREATE THAT
CONDITION?
>> THE D.C. CIRCUIT COULD CREATE
THAT RESTRICTED TIME LINE TO SAY
YOU ONLY HAVE A CERTAIN NUMBER
OF DAYS TO SEEK FURTHER REVIEW
HERE.
AND THEY COULD SAY, IF YOU DO
NOT SEEK REVIEW IN THE SUPREME
COURT IN A CERTAIN NUMBER OF
DAYS, WE ARE SENDING THIS BACK
TO THE DISTRICT JUDGE TO HOLD
THE TRIAL SO THEY COULD TRY TO
SHORTEN UP THAT TIME PERIOD.
THAT LEAVES DONALD TRUMP THE
ABILITY TO GO TO THE SUPREME
COURT AND SEE IF THEY WOULD
CHANGE THAT.
SO EACH OF THE COURTS, THE
CIRCUIT COURT, THE SUPREME COURT
HAS THE ABILITY TO LENGTHEN OR
RESTRICT THE TIME PERIOD.
>> DO YOU THINK THIS SUPREME
COURT WOULD WANT TO JUMP INTO
THIS?
THEY HAVE THE OPTION TO STAY OUT
OF IT AS THEY DO MOST CASES.